the Dutch language
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Topic: the Dutch language
Posted By: Dutch Josh 2
Subject: the Dutch language
Date Posted: 02 Sep 2024 at 2:21am
Can one compare a language with a species ? Both can get extinct...or very dominant... Does the spread of a lunguage influence pandemics ?
A "story" is China did publish quite a lot of info on CoViD allready in 2019-however in Mandarin/Chinese...A lot of "westerners" expected ALL science to be published in English... - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eAUVbUl24eM - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eAUVbUl24eM or https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eAUVbUl24eM A song in https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Afrikaans - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Afrikaans or https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Afrikaans ; Although Afrikaans has adopted words from other languages, including German and the https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khoisan_languages - Khoisan languages , an estimated 90 to 95% of the vocabulary of Afrikaans is of Dutch origin. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Afrikaans#cite_note-10 - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Differences_between_Afrikaans_and_Dutch - Differences between Afrikaans and Dutch often lie in the more https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Analytic_language - analytic https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Morphology_%28linguistics%29 - morphology and grammar of Afrikaans, and different spellings. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Afrikaans#cite_note-11 - There is a large degree of https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mutual_intelligibility - mutual intelligibility between the two languages, especially in https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Afrikaans#Orthography - written form . https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Afrikaans#cite_note-:3-12 - Low German https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Low_German#cite_note-13 - is a https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/West_Germanic_languages - West Germanic https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Language_variety - language https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Low_German#cite_note-14 - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Low_German#cite_note-15 - spoken mainly in https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northern_Germany - Northern Germany and the northeastern https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Netherlands - Netherlands . The dialect of https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plautdietsch - Plautdietsch is also spoken in the https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_Mennonite - Russian Mennonite diaspora worldwide.
Another 5-10 million people speak "Low German"...
Can one see Flemish, Low-German, Afrikaans etc. as "variants" of "Dutch"? (Like a lot of diseases have variants/mutations...is there a common mechanism behind it ? )...
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Replies:
Posted By: Dutch Josh 2
Date Posted: 02 Sep 2024 at 2:33am
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Netherland#Language_and_place_names - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Netherland#Language_and_place_names or https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Netherland#Language_and_place_names ;Dutch continued to be spoken in the region for some time. President https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Martin_Van_Buren - Martin Van Buren grew up in https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kinderhook_%28town%29,_New_York - Kinderhook, New York speaking only Dutch, becoming the only president not to have spoken English as a first language. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Netherland#cite_note-90 - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Netherland#cite_note-91 - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Netherland#cite_note-92 - Early settlers and their descendants gave many place names that are still in use throughout the region of New Netherland. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Netherland#cite_note-frontiers.loc.gov-10 - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Netherland#cite_note-Voorhees-93 - French Flanders ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/French_language - French : La Flandre française, pronounced https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Help:IPA/French - [flɑ̃dʁə) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/French_Flanders#cite_note-1 - is a part of the historical https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/County_of_Flanders - County of Flanders , where https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flemish_language - Flemish —a https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Low_Franconian - Low Franconian https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dialect_cluster - dialect cluster of https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dutch_language - Dutch —was (and to some extent, still is) traditionally spoken. The region lies in the modern-day northern French region of https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hauts-de-France - Hauts-de-France , and roughly corresponds to the https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arrondissements_of_France - arrondissements of https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arrondissement_of_Lille - Lille , https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arrondissement_of_Douai - Douai and https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arrondissement_of_Dunkirk - Dunkirk on the northern border with https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Belgium - Belgium . Together, with https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/French_Hainaut - French Hainaut and https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cambr%C3%A9sis - Cambrésis , it makes up the https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Departments_of_France - French Department of https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nord_%28French_department%29 - Nord .
DJ, When the French occupied a part of Flanders slowly they enforced French...English was enforced upon the Dutch "Yankees" (from Jan Kees-NL male names, DJ-I think "Janneke" a womans name in Dutch may be more likely. The British and "American Dutch" did not have a good relation"...it may in part explain why in 1776 the US did break away from the "British"...and also why English is NOT the official US language...).
In Germany hitler ended Lower German being spoken in 1936...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dutch_language#History - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dutch_language#History or https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dutch_language#History At the end of the Middle Ages https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hanseatic_League - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hanseatic_League or https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hanseatic_League "a sort of Dutch" was spoken from Northern France to the Baltic States...(with lots of variations).
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Posted By: Dutch Josh 2
Date Posted: 02 Sep 2024 at 2:41am
DJ, At present even in NL English is becoming quite dominant... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dutch_language#Geographic_distribution - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dutch_language#Geographic_distribution or https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dutch_language#Geographic_distribution
New Netherlands-USA, like the Dutch East Indies/Indonesia did see the Dutch language disappear within a few generations after the end of being "Dutch"....
In the US English, Indonesia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malayic_languages - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malayic_languages or https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malayic_languages became (again) dominant...
Brussel once was the largest Dutch speaking city...the French/Walon speaking Belgians however moved the French speaking area north...
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Posted By: Dutch Josh 2
Date Posted: 10 Sep 2024 at 2:44am
DJ-One can compare two very different things; langauges and diseases...both may be around for centuries and change/evolve...maybe even stop existing...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_English_words_of_Dutch_origin - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_English_words_of_Dutch_origin or https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_English_words_of_Dutch_origin ; This is an incomplete list of https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dutch_language - Dutch expressions used in https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/English_language - English ; some are relatively common (e.g. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cookie - cookie ), some are comparatively rare. In a survey by https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_M._Williams - Joseph M. Williams in Origins of the English Language it is estimated that about 1% of English words are of Dutch origin. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_English_words_of_Dutch_origin#cite_note-1 - From Old Dutch[ https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=List_of_English_words_of_Dutch_origin&action=edit§ion=1 - edit ] - Many Latinate words in the English lexicon were borrowed from Latin. Quite a few of these words can further trace their origins back to a Germanic source - usually https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Old_Low_Franconian - Old Low Franconian . Old Dutch is the western variant of this language. In cases it is not clear whether the loanword is from Old Dutch (Old West Low Franconian) or another Germanic language, they have been excluded from the list. See also: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_English_Latinates_of_Germanic_origin - List of English Latinates of Germanic origin
- Since speakers of West Germanic languages spoken along the North Sea coast from the 5th to the 9th century lived close enough together to form a linguistic https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sprachbund - crossroads - water was the main way of transportation - Dutch and English share some traits that other West Germanic languages do not possess. Lexical examples are Dutch vijf / English five (compare German: Fünf) and Dutch leef / English live (compare German Leben). These words have been excluded from the list. See also: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ingvaeonic_nasal_spirant_law - Ingvaeonic nasal spirant law
- Since the https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norman_conquest - Norman conquest of 1066 many Latinate words entered the English lexicon via French, which has – via https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Old_French - Old French – a substantial base of https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Old_Dutch - Old Dutch (or https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Old_Low_Franconian - Old Low Franconian ) and https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Middle_Dutch - Middle Dutch . For instance, French boulevard comes from Dutch bolwerk. In cases it is not clear whether the loanword in French is from Dutch or another Germanic language, they have been excluded from the list. See also: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frankish_language#Influence_on_French - Influence of Franconian language on French
For some loanwords stemming from this period it is not always clear whether they are of Old Dutch, Old Norse, another Germanic language or an unknown Old English origin. These words have been excluded from the list, or indicated as such. From Middle Dutch[ https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=List_of_English_words_of_Dutch_origin&action=edit§ion=2 - edit ]- About one-third of the invading Norman army of 1066 came from Dutch speaking https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/County_of_Flanders - Flemish . Many Flemings stayed in England after the Conquest and influenced the English language.
- The main part of refugees to England, Wales and Scotland from the 11th till the 17th century were from the Low Countries; particularly Flemish skilled weavers and textile workers immigrated as a result of floods, overpopulation and warfare in https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/County_of_Flanders - Flanders . In 1527, when England's population numbered 5 million, London alone had tens of thousands of Flemings, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_English_words_of_Dutch_origin#cite_note-3 - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_English_words_of_Dutch_origin#cite_note-4 - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_English_words_of_Dutch_origin#cite_note-5 - The https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hanseatic_League - Hanseatic League had in the late Middle Ages a trade network along the coast of Northern Europe and England, using to Dutch related https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Middle_Low_German - Middle Low German as https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lingua_franca - lingua franca . Some loanwords from this period could come from either language. These words have been excluded from the list, or indicated as such.
From Modern Dutch[ https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=List_of_English_words_of_Dutch_origin&action=edit§ion=3 - edit ]- In the https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dutch_Golden_Age - Dutch Golden Age , spanning most of the 17th century, Dutch https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trade - trade , https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Science - science , https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military - military , and https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dutch_art - art were among the most acclaimed in the world, and many English words of Dutch origin concerning these areas are stemming from this period.
- English and Dutch rivalry at sea resulted in many Dutch naval terms in English. See also: Dutch linguistic influence on naval terms
- Via settlements in North America and elsewhere in the world Dutch language influenced English spoken there, particularly American English. That resulted also in numerous place names based on Dutch words and places. These are excluded from the list unless they are well known, like Brooklyn (from the Dutch town https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breukelen - Breukelen ) and Wall Street (from Dutch Walstraat). See also: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_place_names_of_Dutch_origin - List of place names of Dutch origin
- Due to contact between https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Afrikaans - Afrikaans and English speakers in https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/South_Africa - South Africa , many Dutch words entered English via Afrikaans, which has an estimated 90 to 95% vocabulary of Dutch origin. Only the words that entered standard English are listed here. Afrikaans words that do not stem from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cape_Dutch - Cape Dutch but from an African, Indian or other European language, are not listed here. See also: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_English_words_of_Afrikaans_origin - List of English words of Afrikaans origin and https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_South_African_slang_words - List of South African slang words
DJ, So there are long term links between English and Dutch over a long time/area...(a.o. via French...).
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